Frankly I’ve never had any issues running Windows 11. It’s just the OS in the background for me. I think the biggest difference is I always run Enterprise versions (not Pro or Home) and most of that crap is either non-existent, disabled by default or easy to disable via GPO.
The big thing for people to realize is that Enterprise is the version most all businesses (especially large ones) run, and Microsoft isn’t going to crap on them as easily. And they know by extension, people will run what their business is, but they can get away with making Pro and Home crappier since it’s just individuals who would switch, not large swaths.
Pro and Home is where they test-market the worst of the garbage… some of it does make it into Enterprise - a surprising amount has gotten into Office 365 - but, yeah, not enough to make it completely dysfunctional.
How do you get this? My company has the Enterprise version, but when they forced me to switch to a new Windows 11 laptop (same model and specs as my old one which couldn’t be upgraded to Windows 11 for some reason), it came with all the crap in the article. Ads in the start menu and everything.
My company (130,000 employees) sticks to 24H2. IT wouldn’t approve the 25H2. Don’t know whether the refusal to upgrade hurts Microsoft in any way, but if it does, I think we’re big enough to be on their radar, and perhaps they talk to our IT about concerns and complaints we may have.
So Microsoft is so diversified, 130K isn’t even a drop to them. We had almost 200K seats of E3 and when I calculated out the revenue from our EA vs their total revenue, it came up to something like 0.012%. Even though it was tens of millions of dollars on our end, we’re still a drop in the bucket to them.
This is the issue I have with people talking about how “you MUST always run the most up to date software”. They don’t understand that in large enterprise it is common for function and security to not update unless there is a damn good reason. The very idea that the newest version is the best is just marketing brainwashing and does not hold up to the reality of use.
25H2 is a feature update. 24H2, for now, gets all the same security fixes. When people say “always run the latest” they mean stay on a supported OS and always have as many security updates as possible within reason.
And they are laughably wrong. Its always the wannabe system admins with 4 end users spouting that nonsense. You get into any big organization and legacy becomes a larger and larger part of the way things are kept running. Hell just for shits and giggles look at the back end of blood banks, government, airports and non blood banks back end infrastructure. I would be shocked if anything was running on less then a decade old software. Hell people think that software hardened over years should just be tossed out the window because the company (who has now made it clear they don’t even know what they are doing) released a version with a bigger number.
Just what are they teaching these days? No OS is secure, exploits and vaunrabilitys are in them all. This should not be a hot take but all I see is lazy it departments offloading responsibly left and right. The correct way to handle this has always been from a risk management approach. You need to assume your not ever secure, make backups, develop a plan to recover after an event and if you have sensitive data handle it like it was sensitive. Now a days we have usernames and passwords stored in the same databases, plain text critical data, lack of redundancy at all levels and a slick sales package to justify it all.
You get into any big organization and legacy becomes a larger and larger part of the way things are kept running. Hell just for shits and giggles look at the back end of blood banks, government, airports and non blood banks back end infrastructure. I would be shocked if anything was running on less then a decade old software.
Maybe on the backend or specialized single purpose appliances. Running decade old OS’s on workstations is negligence boardering on malpractice.
I literally work for a government agency lol what you’re saying is nonsense. If they worked the way you’re describing the compliance guys heads would explode and federal agencies would be brought in to oversee upgrades for the next decade
I worked in hospital payments, they used gcc 4.4 in 2023 (but renamed 4.8 for some reason), no TLS, code is 30+ years old. Only impacts a bunch of millions of people.
But having access to the server? No no IT cannot let you have that :-D
Eh, its only scary if you don’t see how bad a new roll out normally goes. Software is a tool, and people should remember that.
But yes hospitals are the worst for legacy systems (even outside of the us). I still remember having to relearn how to fix dot matrix printers because the hospital still was using them and had them under contract in 2015.
I had a few issues with 25H2 on release, but they’re largely fixed now.
24H2 and 25H2 are the same thing, it’s just enabling a few different changes. But things like the new obnoxiously ugly start menu have started showing on my 24H2 machines so I don’t really know what the difference is.
Lol its amazing how Noone in the real world knows that microsoft makes OS’s without all the enshitification shit in them that run decent, dont block features from being disabled, are all around non-infuriating piles of shit like the non-enterprise versions, charge an arm and a leg for it. Then microsoft (or at the same time didnt mean one before the other) releases the functionally identical OS versions but so facefucked full of enshitification shit they constantly break, these versions hold you down with an update pistol in your mouth that tells you inorder to live you will update every fucking shitstorm we tell you to, it rapes yo wife, rapes yo kids, ignores all bugs calling them features, all the while having a bomb strapped to their chest that says you dont accept everything we ruin of yours we blow your whole fucking system sky high. And those versions they call Home and Pro versions.
Thank you! Lemmy is a bunch of people bitching about their brand name laptop running a garbage version of Windows and loaded with factory crapware.
But hey, they get to come here and comment smugly about Linux. Meanwhile, I haven’t read a single article talking about an issue I’ve actually seen, at home or office.
Which is, by the way, totally ok. If you buy an expensive computer and it is getting shipped with a garbage version of an OS that is something to complain about. It’s also totally reasonable to complain that there is a garbage version at all. People shouldn’t need to reinstall their brand new computers with pirated enterprise versions to escape the abuses of Microsoft. At least let us bitch about this here, dude!
Pirated? You may not be aware, but you can download Windows ISOs straight from Microsoft. The second you boot your machine and register it, the license is permanent and you can install Windows forever.
If retail laptops came with enterprise or the upgrade to enterprise was free or the home and pro versions had the same minimal crapware as enterprise then you might have a point.
But that isn’t the case and Linux is still free and not full of shit so the smugness is mostly justified and you’re mostly wrong.
I was criticizing MS before most of lemmy was fucking born. But can you see what I’m saying?
“Never had these issues, not once.”
Lemmy: “Fuck you! Yes you have! You’re not in our tribe!” (Also lemmy: Only idiot conservatives defend their tribe no matter what.)
Can you see how insane that is from my perspective? Installed Windows 10 on this SSD 8-years ago. Moved that SSD through 3 or 4 PCs and upgraded to 11, no problems.
Then there was a very similar thread about people trying to switch to Linux:
“As soon as I get $basic_driver working, I can finally switch!”
Been running Linux servers for 20-years. I never use MS unless there’s a compelling reason, IIS or some bullshit. But the Linux desktop is still a clusterfuck.
“It’s awesome if you use $distro with $desktop! You’ll have problems with $x, $y and $z, but you can fix that by [command line work].”
“OK. I can make Windows go with a base ISO and some PowerShell. No ads, no horseshit, start menu is flawless.”
“Look at this idiot that has to use a CLI to make his OS work!”
These people are like atheists that just learned you don’t have to believe in god.
You just come off as unusually worked up about the Microsoft criticisms is why I ask.
Its not even a lemmy thing exclusive either. From reddit to youtube there’s been lot of criticism of the direction of consumer Windows 11 that there’s people providing guides now on getting LTSC.
I used windows since 3.1 up till 11. It’s dogshit after windows 7 even when I use cmd scripts to limit telemetry and customize it because MS with their infinite wisdom decided to revert my customizations to their default dogshit.
Linux is not perfect at all but Id rather dealing with linux issues over greedy executive decisions to cause issues intentionally.
With Linux systems we never(?) have to deal with defaults decided by the profit motive. The computer might not instantly do everything I want but I don’t have to fight a multinational corporation as part of the solution. That’s what swung it permanently for me. I’m not in corporate IT but as a fixer of hundreds of people’s personal computers over decades, Windows is horrific and nowadays I have started just refusing to become responsible for trying to sort it out, even for pay.
Not only were there several dogshit windows versions before 7, 8 was an upgrade in almost every way other than “omg start menu big now” culture shock. The new task manager alone was worth having a slightly bigger start menu.
Frankly I’ve never had any issues running Windows 11. It’s just the OS in the background for me. I think the biggest difference is I always run Enterprise versions (not Pro or Home) and most of that crap is either non-existent, disabled by default or easy to disable via GPO.
The big thing for people to realize is that Enterprise is the version most all businesses (especially large ones) run, and Microsoft isn’t going to crap on them as easily. And they know by extension, people will run what their business is, but they can get away with making Pro and Home crappier since it’s just individuals who would switch, not large swaths.
Pro and Home is where they test-market the worst of the garbage… some of it does make it into Enterprise - a surprising amount has gotten into Office 365 - but, yeah, not enough to make it completely dysfunctional.
How do you get this? My company has the Enterprise version, but when they forced me to switch to a new Windows 11 laptop (same model and specs as my old one which couldn’t be upgraded to Windows 11 for some reason), it came with all the crap in the article. Ads in the start menu and everything.
My company (130,000 employees) sticks to 24H2. IT wouldn’t approve the 25H2. Don’t know whether the refusal to upgrade hurts Microsoft in any way, but if it does, I think we’re big enough to be on their radar, and perhaps they talk to our IT about concerns and complaints we may have.
So Microsoft is so diversified, 130K isn’t even a drop to them. We had almost 200K seats of E3 and when I calculated out the revenue from our EA vs their total revenue, it came up to something like 0.012%. Even though it was tens of millions of dollars on our end, we’re still a drop in the bucket to them.
This is the issue I have with people talking about how “you MUST always run the most up to date software”. They don’t understand that in large enterprise it is common for function and security to not update unless there is a damn good reason. The very idea that the newest version is the best is just marketing brainwashing and does not hold up to the reality of use.
25H2 is a feature update. 24H2, for now, gets all the same security fixes. When people say “always run the latest” they mean stay on a supported OS and always have as many security updates as possible within reason.
And they are laughably wrong. Its always the wannabe system admins with 4 end users spouting that nonsense. You get into any big organization and legacy becomes a larger and larger part of the way things are kept running. Hell just for shits and giggles look at the back end of blood banks, government, airports and non blood banks back end infrastructure. I would be shocked if anything was running on less then a decade old software. Hell people think that software hardened over years should just be tossed out the window because the company (who has now made it clear they don’t even know what they are doing) released a version with a bigger number.
Just what are they teaching these days? No OS is secure, exploits and vaunrabilitys are in them all. This should not be a hot take but all I see is lazy it departments offloading responsibly left and right. The correct way to handle this has always been from a risk management approach. You need to assume your not ever secure, make backups, develop a plan to recover after an event and if you have sensitive data handle it like it was sensitive. Now a days we have usernames and passwords stored in the same databases, plain text critical data, lack of redundancy at all levels and a slick sales package to justify it all.
Maybe on the backend or specialized single purpose appliances. Running decade old OS’s on workstations is negligence boardering on malpractice.
Ha, Welp. I don’t think you want to look then.
I literally work for a government agency lol what you’re saying is nonsense. If they worked the way you’re describing the compliance guys heads would explode and federal agencies would be brought in to oversee upgrades for the next decade
I worked in hospital payments, they used gcc 4.4 in 2023 (but renamed 4.8 for some reason), no TLS, code is 30+ years old. Only impacts a bunch of millions of people.
But having access to the server? No no IT cannot let you have that :-D
Fascinating and a bit of scary.
Eh, its only scary if you don’t see how bad a new roll out normally goes. Software is a tool, and people should remember that.
But yes hospitals are the worst for legacy systems (even outside of the us). I still remember having to relearn how to fix dot matrix printers because the hospital still was using them and had them under contract in 2015.
I had a few issues with 25H2 on release, but they’re largely fixed now.
24H2 and 25H2 are the same thing, it’s just enabling a few different changes. But things like the new obnoxiously ugly start menu have started showing on my 24H2 machines so I don’t really know what the difference is.
Lol its amazing how Noone in the real world knows that microsoft makes OS’s without all the enshitification shit in them that run decent, dont block features from being disabled, are all around non-infuriating piles of shit like the non-enterprise versions, charge an arm and a leg for it. Then microsoft (or at the same time didnt mean one before the other) releases the functionally identical OS versions but so facefucked full of enshitification shit they constantly break, these versions hold you down with an update pistol in your mouth that tells you inorder to live you will update every fucking shitstorm we tell you to, it rapes yo wife, rapes yo kids, ignores all bugs calling them features, all the while having a bomb strapped to their chest that says you dont accept everything we ruin of yours we blow your whole fucking system sky high. And those versions they call Home and Pro versions.
Thank you! Lemmy is a bunch of people bitching about their brand name laptop running a garbage version of Windows and loaded with factory crapware.
But hey, they get to come here and comment smugly about Linux. Meanwhile, I haven’t read a single article talking about an issue I’ve actually seen, at home or office.
Which is, by the way, totally ok. If you buy an expensive computer and it is getting shipped with a garbage version of an OS that is something to complain about. It’s also totally reasonable to complain that there is a garbage version at all. People shouldn’t need to reinstall their brand new computers with pirated enterprise versions to escape the abuses of Microsoft. At least let us bitch about this here, dude!
Pirated? You may not be aware, but you can download Windows ISOs straight from Microsoft. The second you boot your machine and register it, the license is permanent and you can install Windows forever.
You have a license for some crappy Win11 home version. You can’t use it for the Enterprise versions, even if Microsoft is providing you with the ISO.
If retail laptops came with enterprise or the upgrade to enterprise was free or the home and pro versions had the same minimal crapware as enterprise then you might have a point.
But that isn’t the case and Linux is still free and not full of shit so the smugness is mostly justified and you’re mostly wrong.
Register your new laptop.
Wipe and reinstall an official ISO from Windows without the crapware.
Best served tweaked with some PowerShell scripting.
or
Download your Linux ISO and install
Best served tweaked with CLI work to get everything working. If the drivers are even available.
Are you upset at people criticizing Microsoft? Is that the point you are trying to make?
I was criticizing MS before most of lemmy was fucking born. But can you see what I’m saying?
“Never had these issues, not once.”
Lemmy: “Fuck you! Yes you have! You’re not in our tribe!” (Also lemmy: Only idiot conservatives defend their tribe no matter what.)
Can you see how insane that is from my perspective? Installed Windows 10 on this SSD 8-years ago. Moved that SSD through 3 or 4 PCs and upgraded to 11, no problems.
Then there was a very similar thread about people trying to switch to Linux:
“As soon as I get $basic_driver working, I can finally switch!”
Been running Linux servers for 20-years. I never use MS unless there’s a compelling reason, IIS or some bullshit. But the Linux desktop is still a clusterfuck.
“It’s awesome if you use $distro with $desktop! You’ll have problems with $x, $y and $z, but you can fix that by [command line work].”
“OK. I can make Windows go with a base ISO and some PowerShell. No ads, no horseshit, start menu is flawless.”
“Look at this idiot that has to use a CLI to make his OS work!”
These people are like atheists that just learned you don’t have to believe in god.
You just come off as unusually worked up about the Microsoft criticisms is why I ask.
Its not even a lemmy thing exclusive either. From reddit to youtube there’s been lot of criticism of the direction of consumer Windows 11 that there’s people providing guides now on getting LTSC.
I used windows since 3.1 up till 11. It’s dogshit after windows 7 even when I use cmd scripts to limit telemetry and customize it because MS with their infinite wisdom decided to revert my customizations to their default dogshit.
Linux is not perfect at all but Id rather dealing with linux issues over greedy executive decisions to cause issues intentionally.
With Linux systems we never(?) have to deal with defaults decided by the profit motive. The computer might not instantly do everything I want but I don’t have to fight a multinational corporation as part of the solution. That’s what swung it permanently for me. I’m not in corporate IT but as a fixer of hundreds of people’s personal computers over decades, Windows is horrific and nowadays I have started just refusing to become responsible for trying to sort it out, even for pay.
Lol
Not only were there several dogshit windows versions before 7, 8 was an upgrade in almost every way other than “omg start menu big now” culture shock. The new task manager alone was worth having a slightly bigger start menu.
I still use ME. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
You poor thing